Given the concession that Drayson is a general ass... and given the above; what's to prevent a general ass from generally cock-blocking a PT indefinably? I mean, by those observations, couldn't I just make a point of posting in every Planetary Take-Over ever, just enough to prevent anyone from ever taking another planet?

Because, if you ask me, what I read here is that we have a competition, a conflict. And that conflict cannot be 'won' unless both sides agree...

Very conflicted, and confusing.

Yup, that's the plan Beff. Thanks for coming out. How about taking your overbearing bias for anything not-TNO and doing something constructive, though?

Dude, I have no problem with TNO. You need to understand that.

I just have a problem with you.

And I'm getting sick and fucking tired of the "Beff hates TNO so ignore his comments as biased" argument.

Right. Which leads directly to the idea that the one planetary takeover I've interfered in in years is a serious epidemic problem of trying to stall a takeover of an Alliance world.

If I wanted to prevent them taking the world, and was as much of an ass as you claim, I would have just dropped a fleet's worth of troops on the surface and told Zell to go fuck himself, Rendilli was mine unless he wanted to fight me for it.

Note the part where that didn't happen.

Gash did the internet thug thing way better than you can hope to, so stop trying to live up to his perverted standards and picking on "Demos the ass". Especially when you're full of shit and have no fucking idea what you're talking about. If you're not biased (which, by the way, you yourself admitted to being), then prove it. But this thread, like many others, only strengthens the perception of you being biased to the hilt.

When it comes to you, Demos, everyone is a little biased.

(I'm calling you a douche.)

Actually, Drayson, I have to side against you on this one. Zell wrote a very well-thought-out takeover that did take into account your being there. He met with the people on-planet, set up a business relationship, and thought of a way to outsmart the Imperials above the planet. There would have been no reason for anything to be otherwise. In fact, Zell specifically wrote that nothing would change with relation to the Empire. Probably Sullivan still would have visited the Corruptor to pay the fees, or tribute, or whatever it was; the meeting itself couldn't have lasted too terribly long - perhaps a half-hour, or an hour at the most?

I have to agree, also, that your posts in that thread have been, if nothing else, less than your best. You are simply writing in whatever you think of, not taking into account what Zell has written (which, I have to point out, is the same thing you accuse him of doing).

Taking this into account, I have to say either do better or give up the planet. I mean, come on, how many do we have? So what if they Alliance gets Rendelli? Let them have their fun, and play nice for a change. Maybe if we did that people's opinion of TNO would improve.

All I care about is the issue raised.

Is the only way then to end a competitive thread, such as the one in question, to reach a resolution where-by one party wins? Were this a scripted event, the outcome would be predetermined. But the parties here involved are working at opposite ends and have little or no amicable communication outside of the story itself.

One party cannot "wrap everything up in a bow and claim victory" if it ignores "his (the second party) actions in the thread'. But it can if it takes in to account the actions of the second party? And if that's the case; is this the determining factor which defines a victor?

If so, then is not the issue subject to, well... subjectivity?

And if not, what criteria exist?

If both parties must agree that, before either party can claim the planet, the thread is concluded then could not one party contest the finality of the thread?

If a Planetary Take-Over demands a five thousand word thread done over no-less-then six days, should there not be some similar requirement reflective of contested Planetary Take-Over threads?

Drayson, I admire and respect you, believe it or not. The only reason I ride you so hard is, like Telan, I figure you can take it. But you really have to get over this "Beff hates TNO" jive because it's not the case. The truth is I've been very unhappy with certian TNO'ers; and this is a prime example of why - I propose you only interfered with Vance to be an ass, nothing more. And there's nothing wrong with that; it's a tradition here-abouts. But what raises my ire is that you should have known this would happen, as a veteran member I suppose I had higher expectations of you. So here we are...

You and Zell won't come to an accord, you simply don't have it in you... either of you. So, it'll progress in to another shit storm with you at the center. You accuse me of an Anti-TNO bias, but I have to ask you what bias you have, you who write exclusively as a member of that faction, you who have butted heads with virtually every non-TNO-centric writer here? It is said that the one most ready to accuse has the most to defend.

Let's face facts then - how does this end?

Beff, never once did I take issue with the fact that Zell wins the planet. My objection from the start has been with the fact that he claimed to win the planet before the RP was concluded.

But the parties here involved are working at opposite ends and have little or no amicable communication outside of the story itself.

I've communicated amicably with Zell up until now, excepting my delay in posting. The only one acting in an unfriendly manner has been the person with no involvement whatsoever in the story: you.

just go ahead and assume he's being a douche. I mean, it is Drayson.

rather then being a prick

That smacks of dick-dom.

That comes from one post, Beff. And if Zell, who has a role in the thread, can communicate without reducing himself to petty insults, what exactly is your excuse? "You can take it" is not an excuse. The fact that I'm not going to break down and cry does not make it all right for you to, in your words, "be a douche". That attitude might have worked in High School, but I'd have assumed you'd have grown up a little bit since then.

I don't really give a rat's ass why you think I interfered in this takeover. It's one example out of ten or so Alliance takeovers I've entered. If I was entering every one, then yeah, you might have a point...

Speaking of which, where was your indignation when Dolash did enter every single TNO roleplay, takeover or not, a few years ago? You didn't bat an eye, which returns me to my belief that you are massively biased against TNO.

Now you say you aren't. And maybe you're not. But it sure looks that way.

Wes,

Actually, Drayson, I have to side against you on this one. Zell wrote a very well-thought-out takeover that did take into account your being there. He met with the people on-planet, set up a business relationship, and thought of a way to outsmart the Imperials above the planet. There would have been no reason for anything to be otherwise. In fact, Zell specifically wrote that nothing would change with relation to the Empire. Probably Sullivan still would have visited the Corruptor to pay the fees, or tribute, or whatever it was; the meeting itself couldn't have lasted too terribly long - perhaps a half-hour, or an hour at the most?

Very true. The problem is that he then went and posted a claim for the planet in the Planet List, without waiting to see what my response might be. What if, for example, my next post landed Stormtroopers on the planet? Zell should have ensured that both sides were happy with the ending before claiming the planet.

I have to agree, also, that your posts in that thread have been, if nothing else, less than your best.

I agree. But I note that the alternative if Beff sticking his nose in and berating me for "stalling" a takeover.

Taking this into account, I have to say either do better or give up the planet. I mean, come on, how many do we have? So what if they Alliance gets Rendelli? Let them have their fun, and play nice for a change. Maybe if we did that people's opinion of TNO would improve.

I like how people feel it necessary to ask me to "play nice". What about the Rebellion's other takeovers and threads, the ones where I did not interfere? Why is there no credit given when I stay out of those threads, but people are quick to insult when I interfere in one thread?

The Rebellion and the Empire are enemies. This is a given. The Rebellion can and should expect the Empire to act. So far, the Empire has done very little. But now I interfere with one takeover and the shit hits the fan? Right...

Not to mention, I haven't really done Zell a lot of damage in this thread. If I was looking out for number one and trying to derail the Rebellion, surely I would have just tossed a fleet into this RP (and every other Alliance RP) and been done with it!

Seriously, this "play nice" thing is pure bullshit. I've been playing nice with the Rebellion since its inception. This thread is an exception, not the norm. And you know that full well, Wes...

The Rebellion and the Empire are enemies. This is a given. The Rebellion can and should expect the Empire to act. So far, the Empire has done very little. But now I interfere with one takeover and the shit hits the fan? Right...

This is a good point. I am surprised at the comments about Drayson entering the thread. He hasn't done all that much for all this outrage. In fact, he provided some pretty good opportunities that I, personally, would have relished really jumping into.

In any event, Drayson's statement above is also exactly the reason as to why I ok'd Zell's request to take the planet in the planet list.


But not only because they are enemies but because of the nature of the groups. When TNO does a takeover, the planet is theirs when their flag is planted on the world and an enemy's military might is crushed underboot. However, when does a planet join the Alliance?

When the Alliance Flag is planted and an Alliance Fleet is overhead?


I would think since the Empire and Alliance are enemies their takeovers will be more subtle, especially considering the David and Goliath element.


Therefore, when Zell posted in character the planet's intention, after securing 5,000 words while taking Drayson's current posts into consideration, I said he could ask for the planet to be added under his faction name.

If there had been a battle deciding the outcome of the world, then yes, no claim could be made until the end result because that is the way the story was being written. In the Rendili thread, however, there is nothing yet written that indicates the takeover (as the Alliance is writing it) is being stopped. All that Drayson has done so far in character is add an extra ominious element and only Drayson knows (OOC) what his endgame will be. He may have something more crafty in mind than a simple takeover.


However, I also told Zell, that since Drayson was also posting in the thread, he cannot simply ignore it. If he did, Drayson may take the planet right out from under him as he continued his posts unhindered and ignored. Zell understood this.


So while, for now, the planet is under the Alliance, the thread is still ongoing and the final disposition of the planet will be determined as the thread progresses.

That seems entirely reasonable. My concern was that Zell considered the story finished (since the claim usually comes at the end of an RP).