A Vendetta is a powerful ship, enough to put up a fight against an ISD and win with a bit of luck.

Well... if the ISD was caught unaware (I.E the captain of the Vendetta managed to pull of a perfect ambush with the VIGO system) then it would be entirly possible for the Vendetta to take out an ISD.

Head to head, the Vendetta is slightly outclassed by an ISD. Unsupported... Vendetta v ISD, i'd give the edge to the ISD.

Of course, numerous other factors always enter into fleet combat. If you've got Admiral Ackbar or Thrawn on your side, a Vendetta could run rings around an ISD. Or if you've got fighter support... etc etc.



But I digress.





2 Points:

1)

Corise- You techs, a sound as they may be, are not uber. You continually reference your R&D's with statements like

Morever, based on the warhead part listed in the Starflare R&D, each warhead is worth 3 typical missiles. Thus, each cruiser (with eight tubes) can send out of the equivalent of 24 proton torpedoes.

In the old TRF, stuff like that would have had to have been balanced with some sort of drawback. We had R&D moderators and an approval process.

Nowadays, we let people police themselves. Declarations like the above aren't very valid.... as they have not been discussed or approved by R&D mods. They form a good basis. There is nothing wrong with saying the Kashan engineered extremely powerful warheads.


But don't, of your own authority, automatically chalk up 1 Kashan missile as equivilent to 3 normal missiles.



BUT MUCH MORE IMPORTANTLY!!!!



2)

Its great that both of you are so interested in this thread.


I have enjoyed the RP thus far- its pretty high quality writing. [i]BUT{/i]


OOC FIGHTS NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER END

You're never going to convince each other of your side of the argument. You are inherently biased for you side, your tech, your faction. This is only natural.

If you cannot agree to a compromise on your own... pick an impartial third party (probably his highness Simon Kaine or someone of similar stature) and ask them to mediate. Then abide by their decison. And get back to what matters.... the writing.

In the old TRF, stuff like that would have had to have been balanced with some sort of drawback. We had R&D moderators and an approval process.

For the record, it is balanced, as the Starflare is also over 3 times the size of a normal missile as well.

But don't, of your own authority, automatically chalk up 1 Kashan missile as equivilent to 3 normal missiles.

It's written like that in the R&D and recieved no complaints as well.

It's written like that in the R&D and recieved no complaints as well.

Like I said, in the past we had Admins whose "job" was to read R&Ds and fix any balance issues.

Now... we don't.


People don't always read everyone elses R&Ds the minute the post them. Nor analyze everything in said R&Ds and make judgements.

They used to, but they no longer do.

For the record, it is balanced, as the Starflare is also over 3 times the size of a normal missile as well.

So size does matter?

This is not really a disadvantage, at least in my opinion. If that was the case, everyone would be R&Ding turbolasers that were three times the size of normal turbolasers and saying "its worth three normal turbolasers."


Its important to remember that R&D'd vessels are not supposed to supplant canon craft in terms of power. Kas Katta has said many times that "The ISD will not be reduced to some sort of overpowered scout ship" by R&D advances.



Anyway, an argument for another thread.


But my suggestion still stands- get someone to moderate the thread and get back to the writing.

Would just like to reiterate my downright dastardly colleague's words:

Like I said, in the past we had Admins whose "job" was to read R&Ds and fix any balance issues.
Now... we don't.

Brutus is correct, this isn't the right way to view things:

It's written like that in the R&D and recieved no complaints as well.

Nor you should you expect any.

The real test is when its roleplayed. The; "well the staff ok'ed it so tough luck" routine is no longer gonna fly.

Its down to you, and everyone else involved to decide what is fair, logical, and reasonable.

If you cannot resolve things yourselves, then of course the staff can and will step in.

I might add that asking for staff intervention, may result in you not always liking what we decide, so it may well be in your best interest to solve things yourselves.

;)

First off, I want to thank everyone who has posted in this thread for their comments, advice, and references. I realize that there are concerns for both sides involved with this thread, and I understand the need for people to vocalize that.

However, I ask that we honor Kach's request to allow only those involved in the thread or moderators to post in this thread. As such, I would appreciate it if Beff, Brutus, etc would refrain from posting in here again. If something merits more discussion, I (and probably Kach as well) are open to discussing this via PM or another thread.

Running off on Brutus' and Seth's comments, I agree with both of them. The only reason I pointed out that the Starflare's offensive power was to show that I had not made it up out of nowhere. Size does have a drawback, as one can only carry less of them than normal. As stated above, we can discuss this more if need be.

While Kach and myself have chosen to attempt to resolve issues from a technical standpoint (as that's how we both tend to roleplay), the TRF rules still stand in trying to make things fair, logical, and reasonable. That is where I (and maybe Kach) is trying to head with this debate.

As some of you well know, I have an extensive fencing background, and I tend to view fleeting with a similar philosophy as well. In fencing (none-electric), there is a honor system by which all players agree to play by in order to attempt to make things fair. In it, when a fencer attacks, he or she does not state whether it was a valid hit or not; it is actually the defender's decision to call if the hit was valid.

That's the same philosophy that myself (and in at least some instances, Telan) has carried over to roleplaying (particularly fleeting). I do not post what damage my ships have given to the opposition, I believe that it is Kach's call to say what he thinks the damage should be given how I have attacked and if he can do anything about to reduce that, he should post it. The defender always has the benefit of the doubt. This works both ways, however, and I feel that Kach has violated that in his latest post, hence this technical discussion.

Will be editing here in a few miniutes, a complete rewrite. But if you don't like it, and we are forced to get a moderator dude for the thread, I woudl ask Seth to be it.

however, beff and brutus are both on staff and therefore welcome to post. Both are Moderators.

HOld on a second, corise, before editing I need a piece of information...

That's possible, to a point. However, the range is somewhat dictated by the previous posts. Your ships have moved from their original positions to intercept mine own. In order to get into turbolaser firing range, that's at least 50 km from your original position. My ships jumped to Greywind Ten, which was 50 km from your original position. That in itself gives only a radius. However, by adding the detail that it was towards the Manticore, that produces two points, and consequentally a fixed line that puts the ships 50 km directly behind the Manticore. If you'd like, I'll make a diagram to illustrate that.

The manticore is only fifteen or twenty kilometers away from it's origional position, so you oculd be either seventy kilometers behind or thirty kilometers in front of my ship. Out of range, or right in front of my guns.

I guess you could also be to the left or right twenty or thirty kilometers and, at an angle, behind my ship.

Pick one, or if you've got something else in mind, draw me a picture or something. Then I can rewrite my post.

Sorry about not answering sooner, I was away for a day.

It's your choice. But if they're at 70 km, they will be approaching and firing once they enter firing range.

They're going to be thierty kilometers to the right of the Manticor and a little behind- about in between the three Vendettas and 30 kilometers into Genons Gravity well, about where all the ships are equal in terms of weaponry; no range advantage, and all missiles inrealspace because of the groups all inside the gravity well.

I shall get to it now.

Edited