No, not the recently remade Brit-Drama. No, not the shitty American reality TV show.

Here's the Rub...

(this is a divergent discussion from the Zombie epics inspired by "The Road" which I recently read and watched)



The Cataclysm has occurred. An apocalyptic event, or series of events, has quickly decimated the human population. The catalyst, whatever it might be, has spread across the globe and resulted in a roughly 99% (or more) obliteration of humanity. This genocidal unfolding has left much of humanities works in-tact, but that will not last long as the power-grid goes down, as industrial production centers become potential chemical wastelands. Eventually the dams will burst, the nuclear power plants will meltdown and as such the time of man (and woman) is limited.

What do you do? What do you do?

What do you scavenge for? Where do you go? When do you act?

For inspiration look at the History Channels "Life After Man/People" with the exception that not everyone is gone. A handful of people remain, scattered across the globe and you are one.

The important part is not how it happened, or why. The important part is that you are alive and you have to survive.

What do you do?

I am going to start with the survival kit I would assemble.

As mentioned in a previous thread, I would want a firearm or two. Why? Because I have had a lot of experience with firearms and consider myself a decent marksman. As nifty as something less combustive might be, say a compound bow, and even though much of the ammunition (arrows or bolts) is immediately reusable upon recovery, I'm just not comfortable enough with a strung weapon to trust my survival to one.

For a rifle, I would trust the M6 Scout. It might be hard to find in some areas, but in Canada our gun laws are less restrictive regarding rifles then they are for pistols and I know for a fact I could track one down without too much difficulty. Similarly .22lr and .410 ammunition are easier to get a hold of then some of the larger caliber hunting rounds. It's a folding, lightweight weapon which has a demonstrated track record in the worst of conditions. As good as the rifle is for hunting when you are the predator it's not something I would want to depend on if I became the prey and as such I would like to have a pistol as well. I am Canadian and in Canada we have some very restrictive laws regarding hand-guns so, in the time after people, short of trekking south to find a pistol, I would look to what we have in abundance; Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP). So, because it would be easy to find and easy to keep in ammo, I would opt for the RCMP Service Pistol.

Now that I am armed, I'm set... or am I? It's important not to get tunnel vision, to remember that in a survival situation a gun is only of so much use (thank you very much Survivorman, Les Stroud) and to know that a complete survival kit has a lot more then just a gun or two.

My first stop would be MEC (Mountain Equipment Co-Op) here in Vancouver where I could outfit myself with a sturdy backpack, hardy clothing, a compact tent and countless other essentials.

-Backpack (an external frame multi-day expidition pack)
-Tent (a deep woods, single-person tent notable for its collapsed volume and reinforced stitching and construction)
-Sleeping Bag (something rated for Canadian Winters)
-Clothes (a change or two of pants, plenty of socks, a layered jacket for various weather conditions and a comfortable, long-lasting pair of boots)
-Belt (a woods-mans belt from which can be hung or to which can be attached various pouches or items)
-Compass (assuming the pole is still north...)
-Fire Striker (a flint and striker unit)
-Knife (single tang, rear-edge serration, high quality steel)
-Multi-Tool (see: leatherman etc)
-Water Purifier (best to avoid the parasites that live in so much of the worlds water supply)
-Ammunition (enough to get me to the next town, or to my next scavenger spot but not so much as to weigh me down)
-Binoculars (or a monocular)
-Hatchet (an axe is always good to have)
-Tarp (small and super compact as I already have a tent and will only need the tarp supplemental)
-First Aid Kit (or second aid, maybe even third!)
-Insect Repellent (why not?)
-Light (for limited use, a flashlight and batteries)
-Non-Perishable Foods (but not too much as grocery stores aren't going to suddenly disappear)
-Maps (and a GPS unit for as long as the satellites continue to orbit)
-Rope (endlessly useful and reusable)
-Survival Book (additional survival advice can't hurt)
-Fishing Kit (line, hooks, a collapsible rod)


And I think that's a good start. This would make a decent Bug-Out-Bag without being too heavy, parts of the kit could be carried outside of the bag, strapped to a belt or put in pockets.

For me, that would be Step 1 - "Assemble The Kit"

Next...

I guess we're doing survival kits first then?

Survival Kit:

Gun: Ideally I would grab a Saiga 20 Gauge Shotgun which is the shotgun form of the AK-47 with all of its reliability and what no. I'd take the Saiga over the AK simply because of its versatility. It might be somewhat difficult to hunt ducks with an AK, but not with a shotgun. Conversely, a Saiga equipped with slugs can fulfill most of the roles that an AK can, except for the range. However, slugs can do a lot more damage than several rounds fired from an AK. But more importantly, with the 20 Gauge being the 2nd most popular shotgun gauge, there is plenty of ammunition around for it. (There is a 12 gauge version of the Saiga, which probably would open up more ammo possibilities, but I dislike the recoil of it, especially when if I'm moving, as well as the relatively heavier weight of the gun and its ammo. That being said, I'd take a 12 gauge shotgun if there weren't any 20 gauges around).

For a pistol, I would likely take a Buckmark Camper or a SW99. The Camper because it's very light, accurate, and uses 22 caliber ammo. The Walther/SW99 because it is a large handgun with excellent stopping power but is pretty lightweight with its polymer frame. It also comes with a modular ergonomic grip which can be customized straight out of the box for the user's hand.

If I had to take a rifle, it probably would be a Ruger Ranch Rifle that Kach mentioned in the other thread, or if I got really luck, a Beretta Cx4 Storm Carbine. Both use fairly common ammunitions and are lightweight.

Backpack: For carrying things. I'd preferably take a newer internal frame backpack because of its snug fit, which makes it much easier to wear if you have to run, climb over rocks, etc.

Tarp: This would take the place of a tent in my kit. because not only can it be used as a makeshift tent, but it is a bit more versatile and heavy duty. For example, it could be used to make a rudimentary rainwater trap. A tarp can also be more compact and light than a tent of comparable size. That being said, a tent will be a whole lot nicer in certain situations (with bugs or higher winds, etc).

Sleeping Bag: To sleep in. Fontana(the sports shop a block away) has some pretty ridiculous sleeping bags, some even rated for artic use.

Clothes: Whatever I'm wearing at the moment. My Coldgear Underarmor (it's very nice in the winter), two changes of regular clothes, squall jacket, stocking cap, a pair of winter gloves, and my hiking shoes (better durability and grip compared to normal shoes).

Fire Kit: A set of matches in a waterproof container, small vial of lighter fluid, and a magnifying glass.

Knife: I'd grab my Pioneer sidearm (it's a large dagger with a saw on one side). I'd likely grab another survival knife or Swiss pocket knife at Fontana.

Multi-Tool: Leatherman or Swiss army knife; both if I could get my hands on them.

Small pot w/lid and/or metal thermos: To boil water in and cook. To store various liquids.

Solar Cooker: To cook things in when I don't have fire (whether because of rain or just not appropiate, like in highly inflammable areas or buildings).

Ammunition: Self-explanatory.

Binoculars (or a monocular): Also self-explanatory.

First Aid Kit: I have a pretty standard Johnson & Johnson First Aid kit on me all the time, but if I raided Fontana I'd probably get a more extensive one, including: Adhesive bandages (various shapes and sizes), gauze (pads and rolls), elastic compress bandages, blister pads, wooden splints, tourniquets, latex gloves,thermometer, tweezers, razor blades, safety pins, cotton swabs (dry and alcohol-saturated), antibacterial soap, antiseptic solution, antibiotic cream, surgical tape, painkiller pills,antacid pills, salt tablets.

Flashlight: Preferably a "shake" flashlight because it wouldn't be reliable on batteries.

Temporary Food Supply: Basically Power Bars. Very compact, nutrious, and long lasting. Possibly MREs if I can get my hands on them.

Fishing Kit: Fishing lines, hooks, sinkers, bobbers, pliers, gill net, etc. Hopefully I won't have to deal with zombie fish...

Maps / GPS unit: Self-expanatory, but with a solar charger for the GPS.

Rope: For various things...the uses are endless.

Laminated Survival Books: Whether they be guides to wild edible foods, or any of Ragnar Benson's ridiculous works (ex, Mantrapping or ). I would definitely include an extensive first-aid / medic book, as well as my old school Boy Scout Handbook. Basically a bunch of how-to booby traps).

Backpack: For carrying things. I'd preferably take a newer internal frame backpack because of its snug fit, which makes it much easier to wear if you have to run, climb over rocks, etc.

That makes a lot of sense. Normally I would prefer an internal frame pack as well (my MEC bought pack, currently in storage, is an internal frame) however in a survival situation, versus a back-packing/camping trip, I like the external frame for its versatility; you can clip things to the frame, store your tent and sleeping bag externally (covered with a waterproof slip if you have one) and can even swap out parts of the bag should they get damaged. If it comes right down to it, I'd be fine with either one.

For a pistol, I would likely take a Buckmark Camper or a SW99. The Camper because it's very light, accurate, and uses 22 caliber ammo.

In retrospect, I think I would probably go with a Camper as well. I like .22 and know it's a pretty reliable sidearm and would probably pick up bear-mace and an air-horn as well. In all honesty, I'd rather try and scare away a large predator with loud noise and powerful smells rather then piss it off putting pistol rounds in to it, whatever it might be. As I would eventually end up trekking in the woods, and we have bear and cougar up here... I think that's a safer choice. Save your rounds for things you're actually setting out to kill...

It's just that the RCMP Service Pistol would be so easy to get a hold of in such and event, I'd think.

Tarp: This would take the place of a tent in my kit.

Normally I'd say exactly the same thing. However, with the plethora of hardcore and super compact tents available at high end outfitters, I'd bring one as well as a tarp.

Most of our two kits seem to carry pretty much the same load-out. However, there are a couple things I'd borrow from you, adding to my own because they're smart and I somehow overlooked 'em.

Rope- Because it's smart to have.
Survival Book- Because it's good to know what might kill you!
Fishing Kit- Because fish are dumb and easy to catch.

And something I totally left out...

Entertainment or Mementos!

Because I think it would be important to retain something of your humanity even after society has died. Pictures of loved ones, reading materials, maybe a journal and pen...

I think a few small things like that could and would go a long way to preserving my sanity.

Beff Pike

Because I think it would be important to retain something of your humanity even after society has died. Pictures of loved ones, reading materials, maybe a journal and pen, porno magazines, blow-up doll/s, latex mask and collar/leash...

I think a few small things like that could and would go a long way to preserving my sanity.

Fixed!

But, since you're kind of taking this whole situation seriously:

Ideally, I'd make plans based on the situation at hand. But, a well defended supermarket would be a good bet, to stock up on all available canned food and bottled water, before getting into big vehicles that can crush zombies during the move to another location to resupply.

I wouldn't lock down for too long in any one place, just in case.

I'd basically be Mad Max.

While I wouldn't go out of my way to find survivors, any I did manage to discover would follow my lead. We'd be a lawful bunch just making our way from canned food venue to canned food venue, and once the initial zombie horde had settled down (see: running out of flesh sources to sustain them), then we'd organize for a more permanent location where we can begin farming and producing our own goods to live on.

I think you have a good idea about the guns, but I think they'd bring any zombies down on top of you (due to noise). Instead, I'd use the fuel available to have our 'weapons' as large trucks with metal plates and protection wielded on. That way, if things get tricky, we can put the foot on the gas and drive right out of there.

So, all in all, I'd travel to begin with, wait until the zombies mostly die off (again), due to lack of sustenance or plain decomposition, then settle in and restart the world.

That's my plan.

What, no Zombies? In that case, I get to the nearest nuclear powerplant and make sure it doesn't melt down... use the internet/etc. to find other people if that infrastructure still works... if not try flares/lower tech stuff blah blah blah... join/assemble a survivor colony...

I mean, what are you guys going to do after you have your perfectly assembled camping kits? ;)

Of course, in case of Zombies... that's completely different. I greatly prefer the no Zombies version though. :)

I mean, what are you guys going to do after you have your perfectly assembled camping kits?

I was kind of approaching this step by step.

After assembling my Bug Out Bag, I would probably go about collecting various large goods which I'd deem necessary for my continued survival and such that I might be prepared on the off chance I encounter any other survivors.

I would probably locate a competent vehicle, such as an RV, which I could load up and relocate to a position outside of the 'danger area' and establish there my primary base of operations. While power remained and gasoline and other fuels were easy to acquire I would do just that. I would basically be constructing an above-ground holdout shelter. Things which would become harder to locate and/or come by, I would begin hoarding. Working out of my primary HQ, I would make sojourns in to formerly populated areas where I could salvage the things I want or need.

Home Base would be near a source of clean water, likely a fish-rich river or similar location. Somewhere very survivable and also enjoyable so as to stave off isolation madness.

Once my new home was established I would likely try to acquire a reliable 4x4 vehicle which I would use to move loads which are either too heavy or cumbersome for me to transport on my own. Something like a modified 4Runner, Land Cruiser, Range Rover or Land Rover... god knows there are enough FourBi types out there that with a fair search such a vehicle could be recovered.

Knowing that the such luxuries would become increasingly rare I would, in the early days and weeks, use my skills, knowledge and abilities to ensure my continued survival. I would set out to get my hands on any available sources of information (see: encyclopedias, technical manuals, survival books etc) knowing full well that if humanity is to bounce back these tomes would be invaluable then, not to mention as aides to my continued existence.

Another key would be sustainability. To that end I would try to get my hands on things like solar panels and the knowledge as to how to operate them and maintain them thus providing myself with power. I would probably feed that power in to a network of batteries for storage purposes. A generator would also be nice to have, if used sparingly.

For the first while I would likely survive on canned goods and other non-perishable items while working to establish myself in such a fashion that I would feel safe and comfortable. After that, I would build a garden. A person can rely on wild edibles for only so long before he or she is going to want to have rotating crops of vegetables.

Security would also be a primary concern. And the biggest obstacle to that security, I believe, would be dogs. Without humans to feed and tend them the huge population of pet canines would inevitably become feral and as anyone who lives in areas with feral dog problems will tell you; they can be a huge concern. The novel "Parasites Like Us" by Adam Johnson addresses this throughout and I take to heart that roving packs of wild dogs would be worth protecting yourself from.

Before things got too wild however I would probably try and recruit a few dogs (I have a lot of experience with dogs) to my cause. Building my own pack, as it were, would give me some protection from all manner of predators. Remember, before we started to build cities and burn lights all night we humans were not at the top of the food chain and I think that once humanity is so severely reduced... well... Furthermore, having a few dogs would give me a level of companionship and as a social animal (see: human) having that connection can be invaluable.

I'm skipping all around here and will probably have more to say as the discussion goes on but once I have myself well and truly set up, I would probably begin searching for fellow survivors and having a well set up home base to search from would make me feel more comfortable in that search that, no matter what, at the end of the day (week or month) I would have a home to come back to.

Unlike Paul, who seems to think this is another Zombie thread (which it isn't by the way) I wouldn't go all Mad Max simply because I wouldn't want to get caught in the middle of nowhere, out of gas, with my pants around my ankles... fucked. I believe it is important to know your territory, to know where you can range and where you can hunt/gather safely.

I would also brew beer and grow pot. Why? Because I would always want to have the option to 'escape' and kick back with a beer and a blunt, watch the sun set behind the Kootenay mountains and just know that, though I may never see another human being again, I have can still find joy in life without becoming a totally fixated survivalist.

I would hunt and I would gather (with a minor on farming).

That makes a lot of sense. Normally I would prefer an internal frame pack as well (my MEC bought pack, currently in storage, is an internal frame) however in a survival situation, versus a back-packing/camping trip, I like the external frame for its versatility; you can clip things to the frame, store your tent and sleeping bag externally (covered with a waterproof slip if you have one) and can even swap out parts of the bag should they get damaged. If it comes right down to it, I'd be fine with either one.

Touche. That is a problem with internal frames. I'd probably rectify much of that by using a tactical vest as well. That would also probably replace a belt in my kit. Some of them even come with pretty nice built-in pistol holsters...I have to admit, I kind of want to buy one, but I have no practical use for it at all right now...

In retrospect, I think I would probably go with a Camper as well. I like .22 and know it's a pretty reliable sidearm and would probably pick up bear-mace and an air-horn as well. In all honesty, I'd rather try and scare away a large predator with loud noise and powerful smells rather then piss it off putting pistol rounds in to it, whatever it might be. As I would eventually end up trekking in the woods, and we have bear and cougar up here... I think that's a safer choice. Save your rounds for things you're actually setting out to kill...

Bear-mace? I have to admit, I didn't no such a thing existed till I just looked it up, and I see good things about it. Still, I have to admit that I'd probably shoot the bear (and not with the pistol...) if it pursued me as I tried to back off. Partially because its a good week(s) of food, and partially because I feel that my supply of ammunition might be easier replenished than bear-mace. I'd probably shoot the cougar too, simply because with my luck, it would probably ambush me later on when I wasn't prepared for it (you know, bathing naked in a stream or something...)

Normally I'd say exactly the same thing. However, with the plethora of hardcore and super compact tents available at high end outfitters, I'd bring one as well as a tarp.

I defer to your wisdom, simply because I don't know much about newer tents. :)

Most of our two kits seem to carry pretty much the same load-out. However, there are a couple things I'd borrow from you, adding to my own because they're smart and I somehow overlooked 'em.

I have to admit, I basically copied your list and refined it to my own taste. It was pretty comprehensive from your conception. I also forgot that I'd probably use some of the rope for snares and what not. I'd probably get much of food in the wilderness from various traps and fishing, rather than actual hunting.

But, since you're kind of taking this whole situation seriously.

I resent that statement. I am only taking this situation 200% too serious. :P

I think you have a good idea about the guns, but I think they'd bring any zombies down on top of you (due to noise). Instead, I'd use the fuel available to have our 'weapons' as large trucks with metal plates and protection wielded on. That way, if things get tricky, we can put the foot on the gas and drive right out of there.

And cars don't make noise? ;)

Using vehicles to run around to supermarkets or as impromptu weapons makes a lot of sense. I just wouldn't feel terribly comfortable relying on complicated pieces of machinery that I don't know how to fix (but I suppose it wouldn't be too hard to commandeer a new one).

So, all in all, I'd travel to begin with, wait until the zombies mostly die off (again), due to lack of sustenance or plain decomposition, then settle in and restart the world.

I mean, what are you guys going to do after you have your perfectly assembled camping kits?

I'd likely resettle in a remote area as soon as the opportunity presented itself (the main concerns being food, water, and weather). Once that's done, periodically scout out areas to see how the zombies were doing. I'd like to grab most people that I could find during that time too and take them with me. I'd probably try to start a colong like Robinson Crusoe or the Swiss Family Robinson, except without either's ridiculousness or location...

EDIT: I was posting when Beff was writing, so pretty much everything he said, minus the corrupt liberal decadence at the end. :P

Just kidding. I'd probably do something with alcohol; if nothing else then it's a good multipurpose liquid: starting fires, cleaning wounds...oh, and actually drinking it for fun...

It's not Zombies! Gah!

Still, I have to admit that I'd probably shoot the bear (and not with the pistol...) if it pursued me as I tried to back off. Partially because its a good week(s) of food, and partially because I feel that my supply of ammunition might be easier replenished than bear-mace. I'd probably shoot the cougar too, simply because with my luck, it would probably ambush me later on when I wasn't prepared for it (you know, bathing naked in a stream or something...)

That's a good point too. Replacing the mace, or the compressed air in the air horn, might be harder then scrounging up more ammunition. And with further thought, I think I would want all options available to me. Evolutionary theory states that species with the ability to diversify have the best chance of success and to that end, I'd go with all of the above!

And I couldn't agree with you more about being ambushed by that same cougar at a later date. That always happens in movies! Avoidance vs Encounter, it's a outdoorsmans mantra. Noise is a good way to avoid large predators, so I'd probably strap bells and such to my bag so they'd hear me coming a kilometer away and scatter. The exception would be during hunts, in which case I'd want to try to avoid scaring off my prey and would want to be able to reliably repel any sudden and unwelcome visitors.