I put no view on Saddam. Why? Because I'm not part of his society and don't know any of the circumstances of these actions. And I'm giving no heed to mass media because it's a propaganda machine.

But in addition to Telan's point, obviously Saddam had to be doing something right. Notice how when Saddam was in rule, the country was stable and generally prosperous. So maybe these terrible things he did had a reason.

But then again, I'm an ends justify the means type of guy.

I'm sorry but a dictator is not a legitimate ruler. The only legitimate rulers are the rulers chosen by the people. Oh and don't go all high and mighty on what American patriots did during the Revolutionary war. After all one of the reasons the war started was because of British troops gunning down colonists on the streets of Boston. Were the British troops arrested and prosecuted then? No. And your thinking of Roosevelt there buddy, Truman didn't come on the scene until the war was about over.

Cough cough Herr Kraken - the British troops in Boston were defending themselves. What of the American Congress that rebuffed the parole and repatriation of the British Army which surrendered at Saratoga, thus causing so many of them to die in captivity the following winter?

The ends justify the means, yes, irtar is correct. That is what I believe.

And the people cannot and should not govern themselves - -the exact principle the United States was founded upon, hence why voting was left only to members of the landed gentry and the Intelligentsia, those generally considered to be able to make decisions based not on what the people wanted but what they needed. That idea has become bastardized in Amerika today allowing the uneducated masses to vote based on their own caprice.

No, the rulers of a nation are those that can decide what is necessary for what is neccessary is not always popular nd what is popular is not always right./

Fucking snowballs. They were defending themselves from what? Fucking snowballs, some of them containing little street pebbles perhaps? Nah. If they had wanted them to stop, they should have volley fired into the air before firing into the damn crowd.

Next thing you'll be saying that the Jews should not have settled in Europe and that Hitler is justified in what he did.

I thought some of you might be interested in this... an underground video of his execution.

It's not too graphic, but it does show his complete hanging.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7532034279766935521

Great!

Another pointless shit thread, where people hurl pointless abuse at each other and no opinions are changed!

He's dead. There is nothing we can do to change it. Move on and get over it. That's all you can do.

Fortunately, we all know that both Cracker and Telan's view on anything political is, in a word, fucked.

Telan's dismissal of democracy in favour of a biased "I'm better than you" scheme of voting is a ridiculous and totally impossible notion. How are we to determine who can vote and who can't? Education does not automatically grant intelligence, just as those without education are not immediately unintelligent. The archaic idea of a nobility who are entitled to vote was dismissed because of the sheer lunacy of it. Who are you to tell someone who lives in this country (or any country) that they do not have a say in how it is run? If one pays taxes, then one deserves a say in how those monies are spent and, ultimately, in how their nation is run.

That is the founding principle of democracy world-wide. Not to appease your ancient ideas of honour and nobility, which would have been at home in 1815, but are irrelevant and ludicrous in the modern world.

Seriously, get a grip. We live in the Today, not your oh-so-perfect past.

Cracker: are you actually trying to blame England for starting the Revolutionary War? Their less-than-admirable policies aside, there is no denying that it was American Patriots who started the war. They might have had grounds for going to war, but saying that England started it is like saying that Belgium started WW1. The benefit of hindsight is that it is 20/20 - when you're being potentially assaulted by a numerically superior mob possibly wielding weapons, you'll excuse the Brits for overreacting. But of course, admitting any portion of blame would go against your insufferable patriotism, and we can't have that.

Seriously, both of you need to sit down and stfu.

As seems to be the developing trend, I agree with Drayson. And so, thank you to his eloquence, I do not feel the need to add to his comments. Thank you, Drayson.

However; there are a few things to keep in mind.

1. America proper did not execute Saddam; he was executed by a tribunal of his own people. Leaving aside the names of the judiciary in question, Saddam Hussein was convicted, sentenced and executed by the very people he subjugated for so long. American forces were pivotal in his capture. Certianly there were some 'behind the scenes' manipulations of his trial, but for the most part, this was carried out by and for the people of Iraq.

2. Saddam Hussein was a legitimate ruler. To say that one who becomes a tyrant or dictator is not a legitimate ruler is just ignorant. His will, his rule, is still affected over those he dictates.

3. Stop citing historic examples because they do not compare. It is the recourse of a weak mind to try and find situational evidence to support a current event with historical citations.

And I think the most important thing to keep in mind here is this; another human being has died. Whatever he was, morally or otherwise, he was a human being and he is now dead.

Indeed.

I am having an idea....